147: How to handle the emotional and mental health challenges of entrepreneurship with Rebecca Vigelius
This episode is different—and deeply personal. I'm stepping away from the usual copywriting tips to talk about something many of us avoid: mental health, burnout, and the hidden toll of holding it all together. The past year left me mentally and emotionally tapped out, and I didn’t even fully realize it until I was on the other side. So in honor of Mental Health Awareness Month, I’m opening up about the behind-the-scenes struggles I’ve faced as a business owner—and the quiet moments of dissociation, disconnection, and doing the bare minimum just to keep going.
To help make sense of it all, I’m joined by Rebecca Vogelius, a neuro-somatic intelligence practitioner and stress coach who helps high-performing women feel human again without sacrificing their success. Rebecca shares practical, physiological tools to help you come back to yourself when life (or business) gets heavy—and why rest and nervous system regulation aren’t luxuries, they’re survival skills.
Topics We Cover in This Episode:
The hidden behaviors that might be signs of burnout or dissociation
Why “just think positive” might actually be making things worse
A three-word tool to reconnect with yourself in under a minute
The truth about nervous system regulation (and what calm really means)
Why pushing through stress can silently erode your creativity and capacity
What your body might be trying to tell you when you skip lunch, ignore rest, or hold your pee
How to build resilience through micro-moments of self-trust
The one myth about mental wellness that needs to be retired—forever
This episode is a love letter to every entrepreneur who’s ever kept smiling while quietly unraveling. You are not alone. Whether you’re in the thick of it or feeling strong right now, this episode offers a new lens—and a few powerful shifts—to help you navigate the harder seasons with more clarity and capacity.
Resources Mentioned:
Looking for a supportive business community to help you grow your business? Check out the Joy of Copy Club.
Get Rebecca's Unbothered Entrepreneur Blueprint
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[00:00:03]
Welcome to ill communication, copywriting tips and sales strategies for small business. I'm your host, Kim Kiel. I'm a
copy coach, sales strategist, and direct response copywriter. It's my mission to help women leaders and changemakers
amplify their voices through copy. It's why I'm dishing out all the juicy tips, writing prompts, and sales formulas to help
you generate more leads, book more calls, and get more high value clients on repeat. Sounds pretty good. It's time to
ditch the overwhelm you might be feeling and find confidence in your copywriting so you can get your message out
there and attract more soulmate clients. Let's get started. Hello my sweet friend. Welcome back to the Ill
Communication Podcast, and today I'm diverging from my normal routine and normal content. I'm not talking about
copywriting or messaging or sales. I'm not going to talk about business. Instead, I want to talk a bit about mental health.
May is Mental Health Awareness month, and when this episode airs, it will be the end of May. Now, I'm not an expert in
mental health by any stretch, but I am human and I've had my share of dealing with my own mental health challenges
and dealing with loved ones with some pretty significant mental health challenges as well. I'm also an entrepreneur, a
small business owner, and I have to be honest with you, the last year pretty much kicked me right in my lady Nards. In
the last year, I lost some pretty significant recurring client revenue.
[00:01:51]
I found sales a little more sluggish, and at the time, I was locked into some very high recurring costs for coaching and
support in my business. In hindsight, I probably should have paused some of those expenses because I didn't make
great use of those coaching programs or lean into the communities. And now that I see that I'm on the other side, I
know it's because I was actually struggling mentally. I feel like I kind of got knocked on my ass and the wind blew right
out of my sails. But instead of dealing with things, I just dissociated. I put my head into the sand and ignored my reality. I
also didn't really seek help or ask for help. I just put on a strong, happy face and pretended things were okay. And I
believe part of why I did that, part of why I ignored my own mental health needs, is because I have family members who
are dealing with some pretty profound medical and mental health diagnoses that my quote unquote, little problems
didn't feel like it warranted the attention. But from where I stand today, coming out of that season, I really regret that I
put my head in the sand and ignored the signs that perhaps I was dealing with a bit of depression and some burnout. I
became pretty withdrawn and introverted. Aside from hosting this podcast every week, I stopped planning and hosting
workshops or events.
[00:03:23]
And if you're an OG ill communication fan, or you've been in my world for a while, you've known that I have a love of
hosting workshops, masterclasses, and monthly marketing moments. But I look the other day at my calendar and I see
that the last one I hosted was in frickin October. That's like seven months ago. That is so unlike me. I also stopped
engaging in many of the communities I'd invested in, and instead of leaning in for support, I leaned out and suffered
quietly and alone. So I think by recording this episode, I'm kind of getting real with you, but mostly I'm getting real with
myself for how tough the last year has been. But I also want to be kind to myself and acknowledge that I've really was
doing the best I could. I continued to serve my existing clients. I continued to put myself out there a little bit. I still had
successful sales calls. I still enrolled people into the Joy of Copy Club. I still made pretty great revenue, and I continued
to attend my strength training classes 2 to 3 times per week. I walked, I organized the occasional pickleball game and
take a random dance aerobics class, and I know that my mental health would have suffered even more if I hadn't had
that outlet of people and physical movement.
[00:04:42]
What's kind of funny is I have also been going to therapy quite regularly for the last couple of years, but I wasn't really
working on myself or my own personal problems. I was going more to help me deal better with some of the relationships
in my life that I've found challenging, especially when those people are also struggling with their own mental health
challenges. So I guess I'm able to accept that I did a few things right, and I probably could have done a few things
better. But here I am, and here you are. And it bears repeating that being an entrepreneur and running a small
business in 2025 is not for the faint of heart. Being a parent to our teenage and adult children, beginning caregiving
roles with our aging parents in 2025 is also not for the faint of heart. So I wanted to share some tools and resources
with you. One of the things that helped me a lot throughout the past year is having voxer conversations with some of my
entrepreneur pals, and one of those people is Rebecca Vogelius. Rebecca and I became connected in 2019 through
the copywriting world, and officially met in 2020 at a copywriting conference just before the world shut down. Now, while
I stayed in copywriting and marketing, Rebecca pivoted. She took multiple trainings and certifications in neuro somatic
intelligence and stress and sleep coaching, and started an entirely new business to help women in corporate
leadership roles.
[00:06:12]
Executive women and women entrepreneurs better manage sleep, stress, and burnout so we can still be successful,
but also have some rest and enjoy our lives. I recently invited Rebecca to speak inside the Joy of Copy Club
membership, and she delivered an incredible workshop all about using neuro somatic drills and practices to help you
get out of fight, flight, freeze, or fawn back into your body to have more presence of mind as you navigate some of the
tough stuff in life. And what she taught was something I had never experienced before. It was kind of like tapping or
EFT, if you know what that is. But it was these other little tiny body movements or sensory experiences and
experiments that help you shift from a state of panic or stress back into calm and a more peaceful state. These little
drills and movements help you reset your nervous system. Now, Rebecca has been very open with her own mental
health challenges over the years, and so I asked her a few questions over Voxer, and I'm letting you in on our voxer or
voice note conversation. So next you'll hear a series of questions and answers. We've Oxford back and forth to each
other. Here we go. Hey, Rebecca, can you introduce yourself for me and my listeners? Because I know I won't be able
to explain what you do as well as you can.
[00:07:39]
I'm Rebecca Vogelius. I help high performing entrepreneurs and executives stay mentally sharp, emotionally steady,
and physically well, especially in seasons of rapid growth, reinvention or high pressure. I'm a neuro somatic intelligence
practitioner and a certified sleep and stress coach. And my specialty, I like to say, is working with fed up, brilliant
women who just want to feel human again, but don't want to have to give up all they've worked for in the process. My
work is a unique blend of applied neurology, stress management, coaching, and executive communications experience
that really gets to the heart of the invisible patterns that are running the show in your business and your body, so we can
rewire them for the outcomes that you want.
[00:08:31]
Sweet. Thanks, Rebecca. Can you tell me about a time as an entrepreneur when you were feeling stressed or burned
out, or mentally suffering, and how you got through that? Share anything you did to help you cope or move through that
season. And I ask this because I feel like I'm just coming out of a season like this right now, and because a lot of my
listeners are business owners, consultants, coaches and service providers who may be in a similar place.
[00:08:58]
When I was working full time in my own business as a copywriter and messaging strategist, I hit a point where I felt just
completely mentally fried. So on the outside, things look great. I was working steady, my clients were getting results. I
was, uh, well, you know, using my my zone of genius. That was going to say. But it turns out not so much. Um, and
inside. And by the way, that was part of the problem. Um, inside, I felt really kind of isolated and anxious and stuck in
this loop of overthinking and over delivering and all of those over, over overs. Right. And so I think the pressure to be
the creative brain behind everyone else's business without a clear space to process my own creativity. It's one piece of
it. I think that was what was slowly draining me. I had some personal stress going on in my life as well, and I didn't
recognize it as burnout or chronic stress at first, because I wasn't really exhausted in the traditional sense. I just felt
detached and really disconnected from my work and even from myself. And so the best thing I did for myself during this
period of my life was getting into a community of other entrepreneurs, not just for networking, but for real, honest
connection with other women. In my case, who could hold space for me, reflect things back, and really just remind me
that I wasn't alone, I realize now. It helped me regulate mentally and emotionally, and it gave me the clarity to shift how
I was working, um, and what I was working on actually at that time. So as someone who specializes in helping people
now, like the person I was back then, I do know there are critical skills and practices that are super important for being
able to move through tough times like this, when we're emotionally and mentally and physically just drained and
struggling. And sometimes it's really just about being seen, supported and reminded that you are human.
[00:11:41]
Oh man, I wish I'd had this chat with you several months ago, because maybe it would have inspired me to lean more
into the communities I was already investing in. But it's a great reminder for me now to not only create community, but
also to reach out and ask for help in the communities that I'm a part of. Next question. Given your expertise, what are 1
or 2 strategies or tools you recommend for entrepreneurs who feel overwhelmed or burnt out, or like they might need a
little more mental coping or capacity?
[00:12:13]
So getting super practical with our strategies here, one that I always share, especially with overwhelmed entrepreneurs,
is this go pee. I know it sounds ridiculous. I also know not to call you out, but I know some of you are laughing because
you've absolutely held it for hours while answering emails or doing whatever else is on your to do list and just not
wanting to stop. So let me tell you where I'm going with this. When you override a basic biological need, like going to
the bathroom. You're training your body to ignore its signals, and that habit ends up bleeding into everything. So we
start to ignore our hunger. Even when we get full, we start to ignore our restlessness, our exhaustion, even underlying
anxiety. Like the list goes on. You disconnect from your own needs in the name of getting shit done or because
everything feels chaotic. And so what happens is you end up actually creating more overwhelm and stress when you
do this. So remember emotional mental, physical stress burnout. It's a physiological experience. It's happening in your
body. A lot of folks think, okay, I'm stressed. It's all it's in my head. I can fix this in my head. Stress is a physiological
experience. That's why it's so hard to think your way out of stressful situation.
[00:13:50]
So I teach a technique to my private clients that I call name it, normalize it, nudge it. It really helps you notice what's
going on in your body. Acknowledge that it makes sense because really, truly burnout is your body's way of protecting
you, trying to get you to make a change because things aren't working anymore. And then you want to take a small,
supportive action that brings your system back online and out of overwhelm. So going to the bathroom when your body
tells you to, that's a nudge. A micro act of reconnection. And I want to just I want to just say this though as well. When
you're deep in burnout or you feel like you have no other choice but to push through, keep going, getting your things
done. You're not wrong for feeling that you have to do that. That gets really normalized and is something that we are
conditioned to do. But if you want to get back to feeling human again, to feeling like yourself again, to building your
dream business, you've got to take radical responsibility for this stuff. There you go. Another strategy. Radical
responsibility. It really does change everything. When you realize and accept that no one is going to come and save
you.
[00:15:10]
You are the strategy. If you want to feel better and rise in your business. So responding to one small cue like the urge to
go pee. It isn't a waste of time. And this isn't, you know, just some surface level thing like, oh, that's cute. No, this is
actually really important. It's a way to slowly rebuild your capacity from the inside out. So when you start honoring your
body's needs, even in 32nd increments, one minute you shift from that survival mode that we hear so much about
these days to actually functioning and inflow again. And then you get to be more focused, calmer, clearheaded, more
strategic, creative, and, um, you know, something that I know a lot of my clients are always saying they want more of is
to be present and to rest without guilt and to to have more fun and to do your best work without it costing you your
wellbeing. And that's even when there's a ton of uncertainty going on in your life. It is possible. So yeah, go pee when
you are feeling the need to do that and then practice, name it, normalize it, nudge it.
[00:16:32]
Oh my gosh, I totally started when you said to pee. That was awesome. It's a perfect reminder of the ways we ignore
what our body is telling us. I do this all the time throughout the day where I'm like, no, no, I just need to finish making
dinner. No, no, I need to keep doing this, and I, I withhold myself from going to the bathroom. Anyway, thank you for
that. I guess my next question is it seems like everyone is talking about mental health. And here I am recording a
podcast episode about it, and people are often throwing around terms around mental health or mental wellness,
nervous system regulation. But as someone who's highly trained in your field, what's something that drives you crazy
about this field of practice or the kind of information that's out there? What may be something that is missing from the
conversation? I'd just love to hear your thoughts on that.
[00:17:23]
Something that drives me crazy about how people are talking about mental health and wellness. Well, I've got a couple
of things, but, um, I want to just start with this. Just this idea that we all need to be on this path towards some mythical
state of endless calm like that is the goal. And so the result that comes from that is that people feel like they are failing
at life if they're not calm and happy or this like high vibe 24 over seven. Right. But that is not real life. And feeling
stressed. Feeling sad. Feeling frustrated, angry, overwhelmed. All of those things don't mean that you are doing
anything wrong. They don't mean that there's anything wrong with you. It means literally that you are human. And so
what we want is actually to be able to feel the full range of emotions and to go back and forth between them kind of
seamlessly, like depending on what our day is asking of us, the skill we're looking to build is actually modulation. Not
this forever calm that we're hearing so much about. That would actually suck, right? Like, in the event that you need to
get something done, we need some activation to achieve everything that we want to achieve, to get to the places that
we want to go, whether it's in our personal life or our business or whatever. And so that that really drives me nuts when
we when we hear that kind of push towards this, like really mythical state, it just doesn't exist.
[00:19:22]
We have to be able to go back and forth. And so the other piece, I think that people don't talk about enough as it relates
to mental health and wellness, is just that there really is no one size fits all approach. Um, if you are struggling at the
nervous system level, meaning your system is overloaded and is lacking in physiological safety. What works for me will
not necessarily work for you. Our systems are different, right? And they're different depending on the day and the hour
and the week and the year. And you know, my previous experiences versus your previous experiences. Right. And so
even when it comes to things like therapy or mindset work. So there's kind of two things that I'm getting at here. Not all
tools work for everyone. You need to use the right practice for your state. So when we're seeing, um, you know, all of
these kind of TikTok videos and Instagram Reels and stuff sharing different practices, especially ones that are related
to, you know, vagus nerve or, uh, working with different parts of the brain, you know, all of those different things They
land differently for different people. And so we've got to be able to, um, you know, assess and reassess. What I do in
my work with my clients is finding that really measurable piece to be able to see, okay, what is working and what's not
okay.
[00:21:01]
And so then the second part of this is, is like the reason that mindset work or even therapy can sometimes leave us
actually feeling off or resistant or worse than before is because your system might not be ready for that kind of work yet.
And so if your nervous system doesn't feel safe, like truly safe at a physiological level, which again, comes from all of
our different experiences, everybody's different. That level of threat within inside of us is different for everyone. And if
you are not feeling safe and this is a subconscious thing to it, your your system will reject anything that feels unfamiliar,
even if it's good for you and again, has nothing to do with anything that's wrong with you. In fact, it's your system
working like it's supposed to. It's a built in survival response. So when we like, I just get so frustrated when I see
strategies out there that are like, we just have to reframe our thoughts or, um, you know, do the mindset work, talk it
out. Right. And we do all these things without checking in to see if the body is on board. With that, we really risk
reinforcing the very patterns that we're trying to change. And so in my work, safety comes first. We build capacity
slowly, strategically with tools that are, like I said, assess and reassess for your nervous system.
[00:22:28]
And then only then do we layer in the other stuff. The belief shifts, the mindset upgrades, you know, the deeper
processing. Um, I kind of think of it like going to the gym like you wouldn't walk in to a gym after being, you know, two,
three, 4 or 5 years away from lifting heavy. And just try to bench press your previous personal best, right? You'd hurt
yourself. You'd wreck your back. Whatever. Right? So it's the same thing for mental health. And we've got to start being
more aware of this. So there is no one size fits all. And we have to create safety at a physiological level in order for a lot
of the tools, really helpful tools to actually work. And if they're not working in a moment for you, it's nothing to do with
anything that's wrong with you. It's just the state that your nervous system is in at that moment. And it's it's viewing it as
unsafe. So I think the more we can talk about this part of it, the more then we can have the agency to choose practices
or find a practitioner who can help us choose the practices that are going to work best for our system, versus just
grabbing some practices off of TikTok or Instagram and and then going down a rabbit hole and thinking there's
something wrong with us when those practices don't work for us.
[00:23:57]
Oh, I love this. You're so right. There totally is a myth that being calm the majority of time should be the baseline. When
the reality is that life is 50 over 50, it's half up and half down. The human experience is the fullness of all our emotions.
And I just love how you talked about the work. The work that we should really focus on is modulating between all those
emotions. I also had no idea that some of the neuro somatic drills or movements could have a negative effect on your
nervous system. And you talked about this when you did that workshop for us. Um, but I don't know why I didn't think
that, like, everyone's nervous system is so uniquely wired. I mean, when you say it, it makes total sense, but I don't
think I ever thought about it like that before. So it's a really good reminder to me that when I'm having a conversation or
in relationship with someone else and they respond in a certain way, that's different from how I'd respond to a situation,
it's probably because their nervous system, their brain, is wired quite differently, and that really forces me to have a
new level of patience and grace for dealing with them and with myself. So thank you for that perspective. Now you've
shared a couple of great reminders, like going pee when you need to with us, but I'd love if you could share a link to a
resource for anyone who maybe wants to explore working with their nervous system in a different way with you, or
learning more about you and what you do. So could you drop some links? Thanks, Rebecca.
[00:25:28]
Okay, so after all that, I'm really excited to share with you my new Unbothered Entrepreneur Blueprint. This is my three
step system to get you started increasing that capacity that you need to get you done and feel good doing it. So
whether you are feeling maxed out, maybe you're a bit brain foggy. Maybe you are like so many of the women I work
with in your constantly wishing there was more time in the day. Um, you know, you're just feeling off maybe. Or are you
thinking that you want to make a change and you can't get clear on it? This is the place to start. Super practical, simple
steps that you can follow in order or pick and choose from. And you can come back to them anytime you're feeling off
kilter. So you're going to want to bookmark this one for sure. I know that you don't need another business strategy or
productivity hack from me. You need to start feeling unbothered and accessing what you really want, and the
Unbothered Entrepreneur blueprint will do that for you. So go ahead. It is a, uh, a notion page. Really easy to access.
You don't even have to have notion to access it. And you can keep it forever and come back to it. Like I said, for one
minute a day, three minutes a day, 15 minutes a day, whatever works for you in your day, you can grab it at
[00:27:02]
Well, my sweet friend, whether you're feeling great today or maybe a little on the stressed out or burnt out side, I hope
you'll reach out to Rebecca for the resources she shares. The links, of course, are in the show notes, and if you join the
Joy of Copy Club, you will be able to watch her masterful and truly eye opening guest training she did with us. And I
think I'm just going to make a truly shameless plug for the Joy of Copy Club, because meeting with the copy clubbers
every Tuesday over the last year has been an important survival strategy for me and a great support for me as I
struggled through the last year. The high caliber women who gather together each and every week create such a
beautiful community. We get to know what's going on in each other's lives. We laugh together. Sometimes we cry
together. We don't just do business and copywriting with with each other. We do life together. So if you're feeling like
you could use more community in your life or business, please check out the Joy of Copy Club and I'll drop the links in
the show notes. As I close out this episode, sharing quite vulnerably with you the struggles I've had, I want to let you
know that I'm always here to support you.
[00:28:18]
So please reach out if you're looking for a pal. And don't forget to reach out to your friends and people in your circles,
even the strong ones. Because even if they aren't actively asking for help or seeking company, it doesn't mean they
don't need it. Thank you so much for being here with me every week. I really hope it creates a little spark of community
and humanity and connection for you in your day. That's really what this podcast is all about. Bye for now. And that's a
wrap on today's episode of Ill Communication. Hey, if you're picking up what I'm putting down, I would love if you would
leave a rating and a review to let me know. And don't forget to follow the show so you never miss out on the tips,
prompts, and strategies I share in every episode. They're designed to make you an ill communicator too. As always,
you can check out all the links and resources from this episode on the web page. Just head over to. I'll chat with you
again next week.
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